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Old 22-02-2016, 07:20 PM   #1
Ludrup
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Default Ethics of Breeding

Hi
Can somebody put my mind to rest about the ethics of breeding torts when there are so many unwanted ones out there needing re-homing?
I guess it's the same issue as for breeding any pet. I understand that it is better to have registered breeders than for the animals to come from the wild, but would love to hear other peoples views on this touchy subject
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Old 22-02-2016, 08:41 PM   #2
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I'm not a breeder, but do have 3 eggs incubating. It was unexpected and a bit of a dilemma as I needed to make a decision. This is a one off for me. If they do not hatch I will offer rescue.

Someone did say that it is better to breed in this country as it can impact on the illegal importing trade.

It is good to think about these things and debate the issues, but I also think if I go too deeply I would have to question why I had 2 torts in the first place. I have to confess I enjoy having animals/pets and caring for them. Simple as that.
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Old 22-02-2016, 09:27 PM   #3
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I guess sometimes people end up in a situation as you cannot sex young tortoises. I currently have two young tortoises whose sex I obviously don't know, at the moment i would say that if it turns out they are different sexes they will be separated, will i still think this in 10 years time..... who knows? I have space etc to separate and know the implications but might i be tempted to have a few more....maybe???? Would I consider rescue once i know what sexes I already have and have gained more experience .....definitely if in position to do so.
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Old 22-02-2016, 11:46 PM   #4
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This is a tricky question and I'm grappling with it myself.

I started with a couple of tiny hermanni hermanni tortoises about a decade ago and I always hoped that there might be breeding eventually. In the past six months we've had two eggs hatch successfully and it's been an amazing experience. Of course I'm going to keep them.

But what am I going to do next year? At least two females are highly likely to produce viable eggs. Am I going to throw them out?
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Old 23-02-2016, 08:31 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozric Jonathan View Post
This is a tricky question and I'm grappling with it myself.

I started with a couple of tiny hermanni hermanni tortoises about a decade ago and I always hoped that there might be breeding eventually. In the past six months we've had two eggs hatch successfully and it's been an amazing experience. Of course I'm going to keep them.

But what am I going to do next year? At least two females are highly likely to produce viable eggs. Am I going to throw them out?
No you won't as there is a shortage of thh I breed a lot of different tortoises which I mostly do as it amazes me. The day that I don't get a buzz out of it I will stop doing it the other reasons are surly the more uk captive bred we can produce has to be better and stop all these farmed animals being sold for next to nothing nowadays in pet shops and other reptile sites and then I have to have a bit of money coming back in to pay towards my electric bill.
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Old 23-02-2016, 08:52 AM   #6
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No you won't as there is a shortage of thh I breed a lot of different tortoises which I mostly do as it amazes me. The day that I don't get a buzz out of it I will stop doing it the other reasons are surly the more uk captive bred we can produce has to be better and stop all these farmed animals being sold for next to nothing nowadays in pet shops and other reptile sites and then I have to have a bit of money coming back in to pay towards my electric bill.
Agree 100% with Gordon.
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Old 23-02-2016, 11:21 AM   #7
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Agree 100% with Gordon.
Mary
Thank you Mary
The thing that we need to stop and I have no idea on how is all the tortoises being sold to dealers and the shops for as little as £ 5-£10 each and the more they buy the cheaper they are. Time and time again I see adverts saying free tortoise when you but a set up or tortoise £40 and people think they are getting a bargain until they are then told it's only that cheap if you buy all the kit to go with it.
If you look on other reptile sites and I'm sure you all know the ones I'm on about they seem only happy to let these type of adverts on there which surely proves that they really don't care.
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Old 23-02-2016, 12:22 PM   #8
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I agree Gordon - even tortoises that most people would stuggle to keep in the long run such as sulcata are available for as little as £50 - mind you the whole pet thing seems to have gone crazy when you have pay substantial amounts of money for "designer dogs" which are essentially crossbreds or mongrels yet people will pay alot more for these often puppy farmed, sick puppies than they will a well bred pedigree pup from health tested parents - unfortunately i feel we live in such a "throw away" society that even pets seem to have become "easy come-easy go" and i have no idea how it can be changed as it seems to be that people who really care are becoming the minority instead of the majority
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Old 23-02-2016, 01:33 PM   #9
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I agree with Gordon, I think we really need private breeders, who sell responsibly, so more new keepers are doing it right. We need to encourage people to buy from responsible breeders. And put the pet shops and the like out of the tortoise trade. If there are no private breeders, then the pet shop trade will have the monopoly on the tortoise trade. Not good!
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Old 23-02-2016, 03:09 PM   #10
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I agree with that - i think pet shops should not be licensed to sell ANY animals. The problem still occurs though of all those tortoises (and other animals) that are bought on a bit of a whim or by people who do no research and do not realise the care/costs involved and then 6-12 months later the novelty has worn off and they end up on internet sites for the whole cycle to start again and the poor animal suffering for it
Alot of people seem to want the quick and easy option - walk in pet shop/choose tortoise/pay/walk out. They do not seem to be prepared to research where breeders are and then travel to them or wait for the tortoises to be old enough etc. Also the problem occurs of how ethical breeders advertise their stock - how do people know they are good breeders? Do they advertise on the internet sites that get the most viewing but may be more dubious in the hope that at least some people will pick them. When i was looking at buying my two it was a minefield (and most of you know the consequences!!!) I bought from what i thought were established breeders and travelled quite a distance but my lack of knowledge (despite prior research) meant it didn't turn out as expected!! I contacted several recommended breeders from tortoise websites but most i didnt even get a reply from (I hasten to add that i hadn't found this great forum then ) I think it will always be really hard to know if your tortoises are going to end up in good homes and that would probably be one thing that would put me off breeding any more than i could personally keep.

Last edited by vikki; 23-02-2016 at 09:00 PM.
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