Substrates

[CTL666]

Hi,

I've seen people talk about ratios of top soil and sand (50:50 / 60:40 / 70:30). Are these by weight, or by volume? It's just that the top soil I've been looking at is sold by the litre (volume) and the play sand I've been looking at it sold by the kg (weight)!

[CherryBrandy]

I Am probably being a bit dim but its percentage isn't it? and guide only. And depends on what species you have and how humid you wish it....ask away ! And don't spend loads either - personally I would get one or the other. My lot didn't like sand at all - too gritty and gets waterlogged quickly - generates bugs , CB

[Jan W]

When I first used it I simply used a jug of top soil and jug of play sand but this seemed far too sandy so then did two jugs of top soil and one of sand.

Many on the forum do also think that sand is not necessary.

I started experimenting and using coir. So gave the torts a choice. They seemed to go for the soil/sandy mix over the coir but I think this was probably because they were used to it.

[burnt toast]

I would recommended you avoid sand. Its an old idea which used to be promoted by the tortoise trust. I have heard of so many irritated eyes + its very dry.

Which species is it for?

For meds I like a mixture of top soil and coir 2/3rds soil. ☺

[CTL666]

Thanks!

Do you know, I think I had spent far too long looking at tortoise stuff and was overthinking the original question! Top soil and play sand do have different densities though....

This will be for a Hermann's tortoise. I was thinking of mainly top soil (so I can have some live planting in there) with maybe a bit of play sand mixed in.

You are quite right in pointing out that there is conflicting advice out there so what I have decided to do is....buy some top soil and then follow whatever the breeder I get my tort from says is best!!

[CherryBrandy]

always good to take advice from a reputable breeder and if in doubt I tend to lean towards the breeders on here. You can't go wrong then. Stay away from pellets as substrate and expensive substrate. try go natural as much as possible. You can't beat good husbandry and a cuppa at 16.00hrs daily. CB

[Ozric Jonathan]

Coir is also good. I just use that now for indoors. In it's dry state it's really light and easy to get into position and I add the water once the coir is on the table.

Carrying bags of topsoil around is not my idea of fun!

I find that indoors the main problem with topsoil (apart from the weight) is the dust. when it dries the dust goes airborn and lands all over the place. This also happens with coir but I think less so.

[JerryMaffz]

I use Topsoil/Sand at a 70/30 ratio and have never had a problem. I have heard lots of talk of sand irritating eyes but never seen a post from someone who's tortoise has been affected in this way..I have seen wild tortoises in three different countries and have visited many areas where tortoises are supposed to exist...EVERY area had sandy terrain in much of it's range....NONE had coconuts.

Here's some info on coir from the German government, the bits about spontaneous combustion, keeping away from heat sources, mold and oxygen absorbtion make interesting reading....http://www.tis-gdv.de/tis_e/ware/fas...fa/kokosfa.htm

[Ozric Jonathan]

mmm well I better check that out Keith!

I've been to a few tortoise habitats and I'd agree that they seem dry and the soils are light and might be called sandy.

Coir is quite widely used as a substrate for tortoises but that might not indicate much, except it's convenient.

[Jan W]

This is interesting as I am trying to work out what may happen physiologically ie when the torts burrow down naturally or particularly during hibernation - what is the best substrate for them. I am wondering if there are substrates that allow the right amount of oxygenation to the tort and the carbon dioxide out. (I have made a huge assumption here they breathe in oxygen and breathe out carbon dioxide)?

I have been mulling this over for sometime, particularly when reading the recommendations when incubating eggs and if I remember rightly there were points on the right substrate to allow for oxygenation.

I also wonder about the moisture contents.

My two have always had small towels on top of their substrate and whether coir or topsoil/sand they just go under the towels- which of course isn't very natural at all, but they seem happy. They don't use them outside, but often lay on the top, but always go under at night in their indoor pen.