My big girl is not eating :(

[Hanako]

Originally Posted by egyptiandan64

As Sandy said it's not always stones that are the problem. Infection was what I was thinking, but could be a few other things. Not sure what the cost would be but you could easily have her scoped (going into the body through a small hole with a fiber optic camera) and the vet could easily see what was going on with the organs.

Danny

It is one option, Danny. The trouble is that she is looking so well (not ill enough) that something like that seems to me too drastic. That's so confusing with this illness, whatever she has got. If she didn't keep constantly loosing weight, I would never know anything is wrong. She definitely does not present as an ill tortoise.

She managed to have another drink today after about a week of not drinking (there were urates in the water when she had a bath). The urates were very weird colour. Lemon yellow. Not white, but really yellow. And the consistency was like if there was sand in it. Not sure if she had some flowers because she goes out every day in this lovely weather, or whether it is the illness? (Or could it also be that she is dehydrated?) Does anyone have experience with lemon yellow urates?

ETA: Just realised that my girl has raised level of Bilirubin. That may account for her yellow urates . Wiki says about Bilirubin in humans: "Bilirubin is the yellow breakdown product of normal heme catabolism. Heme is found in hemoglobin, a principal component of red blood cells. Bilirubin is excreted in bile and urine, and elevated levels may indicate certain diseases. It is responsible for the yellow color of bruises, the background straw-yellow color of urine (via its reduced breakdown product, urobilin – the more obvious but variable bright yellow color of urine is due to thiochrome, a breakdown product of thiamine), the brown color of feces (via its conversion to stercobilin), and the yellow discoloration in jaundice." That's in humans, but if we excrete it in urine, maybe it works the same for tortoises.

[Hanako]

Originally Posted by egyptiandan64

Sounds like a liver or kidneys problem to me

Danny

Let's say if it was kidney problems - what would a tortoise take for it? Humans take antibiotic for urine or kidney infection. Are there any antibiotics for tortoises for kidney infection?
And how would one treat liver problems? Should I get her plenty of milk thistle? (that's herbal medicine for liver problems for humans).

[Evie]

I woud think dehydration will account for a lot where the kidneys are involved

The god news is that she had a drink today

I can see your point with invasive investigations and to be honest when my Leopard had an U/S it was horrendous - they tied a rope round one of her legs and pulled it to access the position

[johnre14]

It sounds like your tortoise is in need of something definitive done... ie: placement of an oesophagostomy tube at the least. She is almost certainly in a severe negative energy balance, no matter what is wrong with her she cannot be expected to get better this way, it sounds like she is just wasting away. I don't mean to be rude, but I feel your tortoise is definitely suffering.... If she were 'happy', she would be behaving normally, ie: eating and drinking normally. I would strongly advise definitive action, either at your own vets, or seek out a specialist. Good luck with her.

[Hanako]

Originally Posted by johnre14

It sounds like your tortoise is in need of something definitive done... ie: placement of an oesophagostomy tube at the least. She is almost certainly in a severe negative energy balance, no matter what is wrong with her she cannot be expected to get better this way, it sounds like she is just wasting away. I don't mean to be rude, but I feel your tortoise is definitely suffering.... If she were 'happy', she would be behaving normally, ie: eating and drinking normally. I would strongly advise definitive action, either at your own vets, or seek out a specialist. Good luck with her.

Because oesophagostomy tube sorts out everything, does it! It really helped with my baby last year! (sarcasm) My baby ended as ill as it was before, with additional open wound in her neck when she pulled it out with a huge chunk of her neck!

My tortoise is getting through stomach feeding exactly the same what she would be getting through oesophagostomy tube. She is getting injections with some solution to avoid dehydration. I am really pleased that you can diagnose her on distance without actually seeing her, but would you be so kind and tell me what medication exactly does she need to make her better? I am sure if the vet knew, she would already have them! But you are obviously better than vet if you can do it without actually seeing her.

You would "strongly advise definitive action". Well, my vet is doing his best. But I am sure that you are psychic and you can let us know what is wrong. We can then take the action to make her better.

I am sorry for such negative post, but idiotic remarks like that are very unhelpful!

[alley cat]

Originally Posted by Hanako

Because oesophagostomy tube sorts out everything, does it! It really helped with my baby last year! (sarcasm) My baby ended as ill as it was before, with additional open wound in her neck when she pulled it out with a huge chunk of her neck!

My tortoise is getting through stomach feeding exactly the same what she would be getting through oesophagostomy tube. She is getting injections with some solution to avoid dehydration. I am really pleased that you can diagnose her on distance without actually seeing her, but would you be so kind and tell me what medication exactly does she need to make her better? I am sure if the vet knew, she would already have them! But you are obviously better than vet if you can do it without actually seeing her.

You would "strongly advise definitive action". Well, my vet is doing his best. But I am sure that you are psychic and you can let us know what is wrong. We can then take the action to make her better.

I am sorry for such negative post, but idiotic remarks like that are very unhelpful!

Calm down!!!

I am sure johnre did not mean to upset you with what was said, maybe you have not got over what happened to your baby tortoise but this is an adult so tubing would be easier.
What you have been doing does not seem to be the answer, it is keeping her alive by the sounds of it but you need a forward plan, if your vet is out of ideas then maybe it is time to do the longer journeys however inconvenient and consult another vet?

[alley cat]

I just viewed johnre profile and 10 out of 12 posts are in the Tortoise Health and Vets section so maybe this person does have some helpful knowledge that you should be listening to rather than shooting down.

[Hanako]

Originally Posted by alley cat

Calm down!!!

I am sure johnre did not mean to upset you with what was said, maybe you have not got over what happened to your baby tortoise but this is an adult so tubing would be easier.
What you have been doing does not seem to be the answer, it is keeping her alive by the sounds of it but you need a forward plan, if your vet is out of ideas then maybe it is time to do the longer journeys however inconvenient and consult another vet?

What we have been doing is not an answer indeed, but the difference between sticking tube in every day and having tube through her neck is only difference in food/drug delivery. So having a tube through her throat is not going to cure. It is not solution to her problem. There need to be something, some medicine that could deal with liver of kidney problems.

My girl cost me up to date approximately £1000. It is not that we are not trying hard enough. Getting to a specialist vet at this moment is just not possible. With 2 hrs journey I would have to take 1/2 day off work. As much as I want to, I can't at this moment. That's the reality. So it will have to be my current vet who will sort this out.

[alley cat]

Originally Posted by Hanako

What we have been doing is not an answer indeed, but the difference between sticking tube in every day and having tube through her neck is only difference in food/drug delivery.

I agree that it is not the answer but it would be much less stressful for the tort than having to have a tube pushed down her throat every day

It is a difficult situation to be in with the costs getting so high as well but if the vet is out of ideas and has stopped doing any more tests what forward plan do you have?

[ClareandCo]

Originally Posted by alley cat

I just viewed johnre profile and 10 out of 12 posts are in the Tortoise Health and Vets section so maybe this person does have some helpful knowledge that you should be listening to rather than shooting down.

He certainly does know what he is talking about as he is a Vet plus he is an extremely knowledgeable and helpful poster both on here and a Reptile Forum. I offered to help by asking for the OP's location to possibly suggest a reptile vet, but received a very short sharp response.