How to Tell T. h. hercegovinensis from T. h. boettgeri

**egyptiandan64** · 13-01-2007, 11:08 PM

The best way to tell the difference between T. h. hercegovinensis and T. h. boettgeri is the top edge of the pectoral scutes. On T. h. hercegovinensis the edge makes a large U shape. On T. h. boettgeri the edge is almost a straight line, sloping a little towards the mid-seam. The lengths of the pectoral and femoral scute seam lengths are variable in T. h. hercegovinensis, sometimes even, sometimes pectoral longer then femoral and even sometimes femoral longer the pectoral. On T. h. boettgeri the pectoral scute seam length is always the same or greater then the femoral scute seam length
Here is a platron picture showing where the scutes are

This is T. h. hercegovinensis

This is T. h. boettgeri

The other way to tell is by the inguinal scute. The small scute at the bottom of the bridge, in front of the back legs. On T. h. hercegovinensis 61% of the time they have no inguinal scutes, 14% of the time just one and 25% of the time both. When T. h. hercegovinensis has the inguinals they are small in size. On T. h. boettgeri almost 100% of the time they have both inguinals, very rarely just one and never none. The inguinals are large and long on T. h. boettgeri

This is T. h. hercegovinensis

This is T. h. boettgeri

photos courtesy of Chris (hermannichris23), Charlie (chazza), Dan (egyptiandan64) and Passion des Testudo
Dan

piglet · 14-01-2007, 11:46 AM

Made this a sticky Dan as its an interesting subject.

Darren

HermanniChris23 · 16-01-2007, 08:54 AM

Awesome Dan, glad you did this.

**sarah** · 16-01-2007, 10:11 AM

Brilliant dan thank you for putting it on here!!!

16-01-2007, 02:00 PM

very informative dan thanks x

**egyptiandan64** · 16-01-2007, 02:36 PM

Thanks Darren, Chris, Sarah and Linda

I was very glad to do it

and Charlie (chazza) had a big hand in getting me to do it.

Thanks Charlie

Dan

chazza · 16-01-2007, 04:34 PM

No need to thank me dan you did it and it helped me alot!!!!

thanks DAN

Crispy Rice · 20-03-2007, 06:18 PM

Very helpful these threads!

Now can we have one on how to pronounce the various subspecices ?

Ajay · 10-01-2008, 12:30 PM

Why can no one ever pronounce latin anymore? You'd think it was a dead language!

lol

boettgeri: bo - et - ger - ee (not like Jerry!)

hermanni: herm - are - knee

hercegovinensis: her - che - gov - in - en - sis

most species, genus and family names are pronounced exactly how they look except people argue over pronunciation of "ce" and "ch" quite often

13-01-2007, 11:08 PM	#1
egyptiandan64 Super Moderator Adult Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: USA Posts: 14,171	How to Tell T. h. hercegovinensis from T. h. boettgeri The best way to tell the difference between T. h. hercegovinensis and T. h. boettgeri is the top edge of the pectoral scutes. On T. h. hercegovinensis the edge makes a large U shape. On T. h. boettgeri the edge is almost a straight line, sloping a little towards the mid-seam. The lengths of the pectoral and femoral scute seam lengths are variable in T. h. hercegovinensis, sometimes even, sometimes pectoral longer then femoral and even sometimes femoral longer the pectoral. On T. h. boettgeri the pectoral scute seam length is always the same or greater then the femoral scute seam length Here is a platron picture showing where the scutes are This is T. h. hercegovinensis This is T. h. boettgeri The other way to tell is by the inguinal scute. The small scute at the bottom of the bridge, in front of the back legs. On T. h. hercegovinensis 61% of the time they have no inguinal scutes, 14% of the time just one and 25% of the time both. When T. h. hercegovinensis has the inguinals they are small in size. On T. h. boettgeri almost 100% of the time they have both inguinals, very rarely just one and never none. The inguinals are large and long on T. h. boettgeri This is T. h. hercegovinensis This is T. h. boettgeri photos courtesy of Chris (hermannichris23), Charlie (chazza), Dan (egyptiandan64) and Passion des Testudo Dan __________________

14-01-2007, 11:46 AM	#2
piglet Senior Member Adult Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,976	Made this a sticky Dan as its an interesting subject. Darren __________________ 17 years old 25 years ago

16-01-2007, 08:54 AM	#3
HermanniChris23 Member Hatchling Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 584	Awesome Dan, glad you did this. __________________ VISIT MY SITES: WWW.HERMANNIHAVEN.COM WWW.GARDENSTATETORTOISE.COM

16-01-2007, 10:11 AM	#4
sarah Administrator Adult Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Newcastle-Under-Lyme Posts: 11,914	Brilliant dan thank you for putting it on here!!! __________________ Click: www.shelledwarriorsshop.co.uk STRUGGLING TO FIND WEEDS? LOOK AT OUR DRIED WEEDS 'READY TO FEED' Home of 'Grow Your Own Food' Bearded Dragon, Tortoise, Rabbit, Hamster seed mixes from 89p FREE POST Livefood, Thermostats, Housing, Heating, Mercury Vapour bulbs, UVB etc etc CHEAP PRICES TORTOISES ARE MY PASSION

16-01-2007, 02:36 PM	#6
egyptiandan64 Super Moderator Adult Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: USA Posts: 14,171	Thanks Darren, Chris, Sarah and Linda I was very glad to do it and Charlie (chazza) had a big hand in getting me to do it. Thanks Charlie Dan __________________

16-01-2007, 02:00 PM	#5
aprillinda Guest Posts: n/a	very informative dan thanks x

16-01-2007, 04:34 PM	#7
chazza Member Incubating Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: london Posts: 202	No need to thank me dan you did it and it helped me alot!!!! thanks DAN __________________ charlie beckham my male hermans tortoise hatched 1999 posh my female hermans tortoise hatched 2001 0.1.1

20-03-2007, 06:18 PM	#8
Crispy Rice Member Incubating Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 121	Very helpful these threads! Now can we have one on how to pronounce the various subspecices ? __________________ 1.1.0 Testudo hermanni hermanni 2.0.0 Testudo hermanni boettgeri

10-01-2008, 12:30 PM	#9
Ajay Senior Member Sub Adult Join Date: May 2007 Location: Durham Posts: 1,000	Why can no one ever pronounce latin anymore? You'd think it was a dead language! lol boettgeri: bo - et - ger - ee (not like Jerry!) hermanni: herm - are - knee hercegovinensis: her - che - gov - in - en - sis most species, genus and family names are pronounced exactly how they look except people argue over pronunciation of "ce" and "ch" quite often __________________ Ajay xxx 0.0.2 Testudo hermanni boettgeri 0.0.2 Geochelone carbonaria 0.0.1 Testudo horsfieldii 1.0.0 Eublepharis macularius 1.0.0 Canis familiaris I am no longer a student; AT LAST!!

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