Hibernation... again

[andybrock]

Great post this and thanks for everyone who gives so much interesting information to us less experienced keepers.

[Alan1]

Originally Posted by Kirkie

He has asked the question "is this true hibernation"?

Interesting times.

I was under the impression that no tortoise 'truly' hibernates

[EJ]

This is a main point... tortoises do not truely hibernate in the mammalian sence.

Temperature drops... metabolism slows down. In mammals there is a physiological change that is a response to seasonal change that is not quite the same thing as in most reptiles. Some turtles and amphibians do truely hibernate.

Originally Posted by caledonia

I was under the impression that no tortoise 'truly' hibernates

[Anita Sayles]

Originally Posted by Petrus

Ed,
People keep going on about "the wild" and what is "natural". However, could it be thaat tortoises only hibernate in the wild because they HAVE to. Therefore, in captivity, where we can provide adequate light and heat, hibernation is totally not required? Am I off track here?

... What would happen if keepers had a naturally (wild situation) hibernating species in a nice warm climate all year that kept them active.
I'm assuming that tortoises are kept around the world.
Do people hibernate their tortoises in warmer countries?
I guess they would have to use the fridge method - do they do that?

[EJ]

In the US?... I believe those that live in the southern part of the country for the most part do not hibernate their animals.

In SoCal and Fla the animals do go down during cooler seasons but come up during the warm days. It is based on total average temperature.

Originally Posted by Anita Sayles

... What would happen if keepers had a naturally (wild situation) hibernating species in a nice warm climate all year that kept them active.
I'm assuming that tortoises are kept around the world.
Do people hibernate their tortoises in warmer countries?
I guess they would have to use the fridge method - do they do that?

[Kirkie]

Originally Posted by caledonia

I was under the impression that no tortoise 'truly' hibernates

I avoided using the term brumation to keep it in simple terms but, yes in hibernating tortoise species it is a temperature dependent activity in which the animal goes on standby mode, not burning huge reserves, just ticking over.

[EJ]

Your my new hero for really having a clue... not kidding.

Originally Posted by Kirkie

I avoided using the term brumation to keep it in simple terms but, yes in hibernating tortoise species it is a temperature dependent activity in which the animal goes on standby mode, not burning huge reserves, just ticking over.

[Anita Sayles]

Originally Posted by Kirkie

I avoided using the term brumation to keep it in simple terms but, yes in hibernating tortoise species it is a temperature dependent activity in which the animal goes on standby mode, not burning huge reserves, just ticking over.

So why do many experienced keepers choose to keep their animals 'ticking over' during winter?
What are the benefits?

What lead keepers to the train of thought that tortoises need brumation/hibernation in captivity when we can provide heat/light and food through the winter months keeping them active and well.

[Pussygalore]

I now think that its going to depend on the tortoise as much as anything else, ie if your tort is alert,eating and healthy and you are happy to overwinter then so be it but many of us do have animals which it would be impossible to keep awake. Those animals I beleive would be more at risk being awake than being allowed to do what they want regardless of the conditions ie heat/.light etc, I strongly beleive that I would have a dead adult female Ibera if I tried to force her to stay awake where as another animal might be happy to do so. There are many posts on here over the winter months where worried owners have miserable, not eating and very lethargic torts which end up almost having to be force fed to keep them from doing what that individual animal wants to do, in those cases I think it would be kinder and healthier to allow the tort to hibernate even if its just a short one, maybe some have much stronger instincts than others. I don't think you can generalize and say that 'all' torts can be kept awake it very much depends on the animal and has nothing to do with what we as owners want or prefer to do.

[Petrus]

Originally Posted by Pussygalore

I now think that its going to depend on the tortoise as much as anything else, ie if your tort is alert,eating and healthy and you are happy to overwinter then so be it but many of us do have animals which it would be impossible to keep awake. Those animals I beleive would be more at risk being awake than being allowed to do what they want regardless of the conditions ie heat/.light etc, I strongly beleive that I would have a dead adult female Ibera if I tried to force her to stay awake where as another animal might be happy to do so. There are many posts on here over the winter months where worried owners have miserable, not eating and very lethargic torts which end up almost having to be force fed to keep them from doing what that individual animal wants to do, in those cases I think it would be kinder and healthier to allow the tort to hibernate even if its just a short one, maybe some have much stronger instincts than others. I don't think you can generalize and say that 'all' torts can be kept awake it very much depends on the animal and has nothing to do with what we as owners want or prefer to do.

Interesting post. I'm interested in why a tortoise that is kept indoors would be so determined to hibernate. Surely if you had adequate light and heat the tortoise would be happy...?

I'm slowly but surely coming to the conclusion that hibernation is unnecessary in captivity. The tortoise hibernates in response to it's surroundings, not because it has to. Therefore, if the tortoise has the correct surroundings then it doesn;t need to hibernate. When you hear so many horror stories, ie. "I hibernated last year and it was fine, I don't understand what went wrong, I followed all the advice given" you really must ask why a keeper would take such a risk.