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Old 14-02-2017, 02:36 PM   #1
Gru14
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Default My baby is poorly - advice please

Hi all,

Long time lurker here.
My little guy Tello is sick. We've had him for around 4 years, I don't know much about his history as we adopted him but I believe he is around 6/7 years old. Horsefield by the way.

He is very quiet in the winter so I didn't think much of the fact that he left some food for a couple of days last week, although I always wake him and shove him under his lamp each day, some days he resents it - some days he wakes up and has a rummage around. He has a large shallow 'watering hole' which he takes himself off to soak into and when he doesn't soak himself, i bathe him for around 15-20 mins.

However, Friday last week I noticed he had left 3 days worth of food which I kept having to remove and replace so I woke him and gave him an extra long soak. He immediately wasn't his usual self, he is usually so lively and he just looked sad and pathetic, no energy and letting me move his limbs around freely also reluctant to open eyes (eyes also looked slightly sunken). I immediately knew he wasn't right so off to vets we went v quickly.

Vet checked him over (good vet) and advised he was dehydrated so prescribed extra long soaks (30 mins plus) at least twice a day with reptoboost, extra heat and a course of antibiotics to be injected once every 72 hours.

He's had his second shot today, and I am really worried. He has been eating but only if I hand feed him but I've noticed he hasn't pooped. He seems to struggle to open his eyes although I wouldn't say they were puffy - his inner lid seems to be a little sore (I have rinsed with salt warm water best I could).


He has 50/50 playsand/top soil table, heat currently around 32 under his lamp and room warm as ive left heating on for him. I've sectioned off an area as his table is massive to ensure he keeps his temp up and lamp has been on 24/7 while he's been ill.

I'm so worried that I've let him down and I'm really concerned he's got gut impaction or something. I've kept rabbits all my life and oddly tortoises are quite similar (which is why rabbits need excellent exotic vets to be treated correctly when they're sick too) and am just thinking the worse here. It's day 4 of me noticing he's not well but I feel terrible I didn't notice sooner.
Any ideas what his prognosis could be and when I should return to the vets? I understand abx take longer to metabolise with torts but was hoping to see some improvement in him by now
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Old 14-02-2017, 03:36 PM   #2
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Hi there, sorry to hear your tort isn't well. It sounds like his temps are good, I would keep him warm at night too with a ceramic heat emitter ( not light) for antibiotics to work you need to keep him at 30c 24/7. Is your exotics vet a specialist in tortoises, because this can make all the difference. I wonder if it might be worth an exray to see if he is constipated or has a bladder stone or both, have you noticed him straining, is he passing urine. I'm not sure why the vet is giving him antibiotics if he/she doesn't know what's wrong, if there's not constipation or bladder stone, a blood test might be the next step. Keep up with the warm baths and heat night and day. If he seems worse by tomorrow, I would go back to the vet. What area are you, there are good reptile vets in Bath , Swindon, Andover, and Cardiff .
Diagnosing tortoises can be very difficult, not at all like diagnosing mammals.
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Old 14-02-2017, 03:45 PM   #3
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Thanks for your reply!
He hasn't passed any urine, nothing at all that I have seen. I've not noticed him straining either.

He went to the Barrier Animal Clinic in Charlton which is listed on the tortoise table site as a specialist reptile vet. I wonder if I ought to seek a second opinion.
I don't know if I'm just being impatient and I don't want to stress him needlessly by having him poked around you know.
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Old 16-02-2017, 02:10 PM   #4
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The tortoise table is a good site for information, is there any change in your tort, good or bad ?

Anyone else got any ideas please, Gordon, Clare ?
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Old 16-02-2017, 09:01 PM   #5
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Sorry to hear little Tello is poorly it is an unsettling time. I know people on here say that Vit A deficiency is not common but UV A in the spectrum strips Vit A out of the body - not just tortoises. Bit like fizzy drinks strip calcium out of the body. My opinion is to buy some carrot juice or failing that Hipp Organic carrot food (baby section) and bath him daily at least in that. I had a tortoise with massive swollen eyes and it wasn't until I did that he started getting better. My only other thoughts are I know antibiotics work at a certain temperature but I believe in a cool down period. It wouldn't harm to reduce temps for a period in my opinion at night, CB
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Old 17-02-2017, 04:41 PM   #6
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Hi chaps (and chapess's)

Thanks for your advice. Tello is still not well. He did a pee yesterday (all over my hand.. I was so happy with that) he passed some urates and they were grainy so I know he was dehydrated for sure. He's been soaked so much over past few days I think he is really beginning to resent me. I've done carrot and reptoboost baths.

Today, he has been a little worse for wear, he is struggling to open his eyes. When he does (which is only if I soak him and pick him up), his eyes are shiny and black but he looks how you feel when someone puts the light on in middle of the night and wakes you. I note there is I think an inflammation of the inner eye lid (my rabbit had a similar situation a few months back) or tiny weeny bit of discharge. He goes straight back to sleep after soaks. Today he hasn't eaten which concerns me, because the rest of the week he has at least eaten when I've handed it to him.

He had his 3rd abx injection this morning, I am wondering whether it is this that's making him sleepy rather than infection. Still no other visible signs of illness - nose, mouth clear. Just his eyes being 'sticky' i would describe.
He's on coco coir now as I changed his substrate incase of any bacterial nasties.
Just unsure what the root cause is, if he had a runny nose I would be confident in respiratory problem but I find it odd it's just the eyes and this very lethargic behaviour. He has not pooed yet which is a concern, thought he was going to earlier but it er.. didn't transpire. He doesn't appear to be straining but if I'm 100% honest not sure I'd know what that looked like anyway.

I called my vet who said it isn't unusual for them to react this v tired way mid-abx but, I've decided to take him in for a check up tomorrow because of this lack of eating today. Rather be safe than sorry and I've the option to commit him as an inpatient if needed, it's £150 a week but at the end of the day, it's worth that for me to have someone with him 24/7 as I can't be here Mon-Weds during the day.
He's so bummed out I don't think it would stress him too much being in new environment and I think it is a price worth paying. He's currently sleeping under his CHE, I've set it to 32ish.

I am just wracked with worry and guilt and praying he pulls through.
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Old 19-02-2017, 11:48 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gru14 View Post
Hi chaps (and chapess's)

Thanks for your advice. Tello is still not well. He did a pee yesterday (all over my hand.. I was so happy with that) he passed some urates and they were grainy so I know he was dehydrated for sure. He's been soaked so much over past few days I think he is really beginning to resent me. I've done carrot and reptoboost baths.

Today, he has been a little worse for wear, he is struggling to open his eyes. When he does (which is only if I soak him and pick him up), his eyes are shiny and black but he looks how you feel when someone puts the light on in middle of the night and wakes you. I note there is I think an inflammation of the inner eye lid (my rabbit had a similar situation a few months back) or tiny weeny bit of discharge. He goes straight back to sleep after soaks. Today he hasn't eaten which concerns me, because the rest of the week he has at least eaten when I've handed it to him.

He had his 3rd abx injection this morning, I am wondering whether it is this that's making him sleepy rather than infection. Still no other visible signs of illness - nose, mouth clear. Just his eyes being 'sticky' i would describe.
He's on coco coir now as I changed his substrate incase of any bacterial nasties.
Just unsure what the root cause is, if he had a runny nose I would be confident in respiratory problem but I find it odd it's just the eyes and this very lethargic behaviour. He has not pooed yet which is a concern, thought he was going to earlier but it er.. didn't transpire. He doesn't appear to be straining but if I'm 100% honest not sure I'd know what that looked like anyway.

I called my vet who said it isn't unusual for them to react this v tired way mid-abx but, I've decided to take him in for a check up tomorrow because of this lack of eating today. Rather be safe than sorry and I've the option to commit him as an inpatient if needed, it's £150 a week but at the end of the day, it's worth that for me to have someone with him 24/7 as I can't be here Mon-Weds during the day.
He's so bummed out I don't think it would stress him too much being in new environment and I think it is a price worth paying. He's currently sleeping under his CHE, I've set it to 32ish.

I am just wracked with worry and guilt and praying he pulls through.
I was just wondering if your vet had taken any swabs and sent them off as am sure this would be helpful to know if the antibiotics are correct.

I personally think you are doing all the right things and it will just take a lot of time for your poor tortoise to recover.
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Old 19-02-2017, 02:42 PM   #8
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I agree with Mary, I think the vet should be taking either swabs or doing blood tests or both, to be sure he is having the right antibiotics, rather than just giving him a generic one that covers a general number of issues. Also I think I would ask for an X-ray,possible even a ct scan. But keep him warn 24/7 as you are doing, keep soaking in a warm bath daily and keep offering small amounts of food. If it was me, and the vet doesn't do a blood test and an X-ray , personally I would find another specialist tortoise vet. I really hope he picks up soon, but please keep us posted. My question to the vet would be " what are you giving the antibiotics for?"
Also leaving him as an inpatient could stress him and possibly making him worse.
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Old 19-02-2017, 07:58 PM   #9
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yes I agree too, sometimes the stress can be worse than the illness. I usually leave mine well alone - me for one if Im unwell want to be left in peace. The other thing you could try on his eye is opticom. I have always had good results with this. It's over the counter I believe but had good advice from both vet and GP that it includes an ingredient which aids recovery in the eye well despite being a general 'hayfever' solution. Keep us update where can as we all learn on here. CB
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