Random thoughts on acquiring torts.

[Ozric Jonathan]

Wolfgang's book is brilliant and slightly eccentric too. He has listed plants as tortoise food plants which we normally say they shouldn't eat such as wild carrot and red poppy.

Wolfgang was good enough to reply to me when I questionned this. He has seen wild tortoises eat those plants and as far as he is concerned they are edible. But I wouldn't feed those plants to a captive tortoise even so, and I think we need to draw a line somewhere between what is OK for a wild animal and a captive one.

If Wolfgang says he observed really small tortoises in the wild interacting with each other then I don't hesitate to accept it but I'm not sure what that says about the needs of captive ones.

[Suze65]

Originally Posted by Ozric Jonathan

Wolfgang's book is brilliant and slightly eccentric too. He has listed plants as tortoise food plants which we normally say they shouldn't eat such as wild carrot and red poppy.

Wolfgang was good enough to reply to me when I questionned this. He has seen wild tortoises eat those plants and as far as he is concerned they are edible. But I wouldn't feed those plants to a captive tortoise even so, and I think we need to draw a line somewhere between what is OK for a wild animal and a captive one.

If Wolfgang says he observed really small tortoises in the wild interacting with each other then I don't hesitate to accept it but I'm not sure what that says about the needs of captive ones.

I agree it's a great book, I love it. But when I pointed out a few things I had read in it, some people did suggest that his ideas where a bit out there, and how could anyone possibly observe hatchlings in the wild as they are so secretive. He suggests in the book that hatchlings actually imprint on there own species when they are together in their little group, again I was told this isn't true. And to be honest I felt a bit silly. So I was left feeling you can't believe everything you read.

[JerryMaffz]

Your dead right Suze, we can't believe everything we read, but we can benefit from others experiences. We are all taking on information and evaluating it to see if it will give our tortoises a better life. We also have the difficulty of deciding whos advice to follow, it's a minefield. Wolfgangs tortoises do look healthy and happy though. I'd say we usually learn more from the mavericks of this world.

[yuna1971]

Originally Posted by JerryMaffz

Your dead right Suze, we can't believe everything we read, but we can benefit from others experiences. We are all taking on information and evaluating it to see if it will give our tortoises a better life. We also have the difficulty of deciding whos advice to follow, it's a minefield. Wolfgangs tortoises do look healthy and happy though. I'd say we usually learn more from the mavericks of this world.

That's a great and thoughtful post right there. xx

[vikki]

Hi Keith - I agree - sometimes it is the people who are prepared to think outside the box and try new things that can teach us the most

[Suze65]

Originally Posted by JerryMaffz

Your dead right Suze, we can't believe everything we read, but we can benefit from others experiences. We are all taking on information and evaluating it to see if it will give our tortoises a better life. We also have the difficulty of deciding whos advice to follow, it's a minefield. Wolfgangs tortoises do look healthy and happy though. I'd say we usually learn more from the mavericks of this world.

I agree, and as well as doing research and listening to other experienced keepers, tortoise keeping is about observing your tortoise and adjusting things to suit the individual , and solving problems buy thinking outside the box. But I am talking about experienced keepers here, who did question his more " out there" ideas like hatchlings I printing on there own species. All I'm saying is don't read a book like this and necessarily take it as gospel.

[Pussygalore]

I think it all depends on the amount of land you have for example Chris in Scotland has paddocks and keeps many, or so I think , together but I don't know whether they live in a group or choose to live apart but I imagine they have the space to choose. But the average garden is limited in space and a run where torts can always see each other may not be ideal for more than one or they may be ok as youngsters but as they get older object to the other being there, then comes the problem that new owners haven't thought enough about, the possibility of having to get rid of one. Its possible to have several small enclosures but personally I'd rather have one large one or one large one split into two and know the torts have the space to roam than keep them in small runs just to have a larger number of torts.

[JerryMaffz]

Originally Posted by Suze65

All I'm saying is don't read a book like this and necessarily take it as gospel.

That's exactly why I started this thread..thanks for your input Suze.

[sandy]

Originally Posted by JerryMaffz

That's exactly why I started this thread..thanks for your input Suze.

Unfortuantely a lot of books are out of date by the time they are printed:0(

[alley cat]

Originally Posted by Suze65

I agree, and as well as doing research and listening to other experienced keepers, tortoise keeping is about observing your tortoise and adjusting things to suit the individual , and solving problems buy thinking outside the box. But I am talking about experienced keepers here, who did question his more " out there" ideas like hatchlings I printing on there own species. All I'm saying is don't read a book like this and necessarily take it as gospel.

I have only read bits of that book as I borrowed it but thought it was a very interesting and informative book however at the end of the day it is just one persons interpretation of what he observed. You have to wonder though if he is just way ahead of everyone else and more open minded which would make him a target for criticism when actually in years to come his studies could be considered very valuable.