2 lots of species identification wanted!

[littlemonster]

I have my 2 quite old (well.. or middle aged maybe..) tortoises, they've been in the family for 40+ years and must be 50+ years old!

However due to lack of info when my parents/grandparents got them and such, I've never known exactly what species they are! Tried to keep the

So, this is my girly, Tommy (originally thought to be a boy hence name), she's about 21 x 13cm (13 at the middle of her shell not the widest point), I've been told horsefield but not so sure that's right. I know her shell especially isn't in great condition so not sure if that makes it harder.






This is Torty, approx 17 x 11cm, and pretty sure he's a he (originally thought to be a girl actually, assumed the larger must be a boy and smaller a girl!). Been told hermann's, spur thigh, even been told a cross. So again no actual idea!






Thankyou

[littlemonster]

Ahh we were told 2 different species! Though now you mention it they do look similar. I realise from looking at pictures how poor a condition their shells are too!

Quite old yes, I've found out from Dad the holes were before my grandparents had them, they've been in the family for about 40 years. They weren't small when found so I'd guess at least 50 as I said, could well be older though!

Thanks, will do some extra reading on the specific species Seems I've been lucky to not have RNS with them!

[littlemonster]

Thanks I suppose most you see are somewhat.. younger! They've had a good bathe and a gentle toothbrushing today and look less dusty too

Thankyou for identifying my torts!

[Helen M]

The male is a spurthighed but he appears to be a different subspecies to your female. Hopefully someone who keeps these guys will know better.

Helen xx

[joekent]

I agree with Stells. Their shells look great. The small holes indicate that they were originally wild caught. The tortoise collectors drilled a small hole and tied a number of tortoises under a bush and then later came back and collected the tortoises on mass.

[littlemonster]

Ahhh is that why holes were drilled? Glad their shells look ok When I googled most were somewhat shinier, but if theirs look ok then that's ok for me

Thanks for the help This is a lovely forum

[harwood09]

I would agree both T.g.graeca

Also just to point out drilled holes aren't always a sign of wild caught as people have been know to drill holes so as to tie a rope to them to stop them wandering out of their garden

[kat4788]

People would actually drill holes? That is awful! But lovely torts none the less. It's nice to see someone taking good care of them now. I am new to this but know they are defo not horsefields. T.g.gracea seem the most likely species

[littlemonster]

It is awful, but I suppose people may have presumed it was harmless, like clipping fingernails.. doesn't make it right, but more understandable.

Done a couple of gentle cleanings and examined them well and am now 100% sure you were all correct and they're T. Graeca Graeca, the shape of the bits of the plastron especially match perfectly, both to the sticky in here and on a couple of websites

Thankyou!

[egyptiandan64]

I agree They are both Algerian spur-thighs, Testudo graeca graeca. First one female and second one male.

Danny