Pyramiding - Are Some Species More Susceptible?

[Lilblighter]

Hello All,

I've been wondering whether certain species are more susceptible to pyramiding than others. I'm sure that poor dietary and lighting conditions contributing to it can affect all species, but I'm interested from your practical experiences whether for example, Hermanns tortoises tend to pyramid more than Horsefields or vice-versa, given their similar dietary requirements, which may not have been followed properly, causing cases of it which you may have encountered over the years.

I'm interested in your opinions.

Regards,

[Søe]

I recon all turtles can develop strange caparapexes, if not treated right. At least I have seen that on all the european and "russian" turtles.
Pyramids I havent seen on horsfieldii, but just as strange deformaties.

To develop a perfect carapex and a sound growth, we still need to learn someting.
Thats why I started up a few experiments.
Goal is to make sound and good looking turtles breedable in 3 years maybe less.
Can it be made? I don`t know, BUT I try and will with some THH and som TM.
Time will tell
At least my first experiment with THH is going well. I just added some freshly hatched TM to the experiment. These are nearly right out of the eggs.
Cannot say other than it is an interesting project to examine. Time will tell if I did it right or have to start over agan

[FLINTUS]

Originally Posted by stells

Some will say that some species... stars... leopards... naturally pyramid... and athough cases havebeen found in the wild... there are others in the same species that are perfectly smooth... they can also be grown in captivity smooth...

All tortoises will pyramid if conditions aren't correct... temperature and hydration being the main two culprits... not diet. Horsfields tend to have a more quilted appearance than pyramided appearance.

I don't think a species is naturally more sensitive to pyramiding than another, personally I think it's down to how badly wrong there care is. Personally I think Leopards and Sullys are fed too much and kept at too low humidity, somone on RFUK has a friend with a smooth one and is trying to get a pic. Red foots tend to be overfed on protein or have a lack of humidity, Horsfields are left to stuff themselves, Stars I don't really know as I have hardly any experience with them but I might guess at low humidity again. A lot of the species we see smooth, like hingebacks are generally WC of course. I think the main problem is apart from the obvious in too much food is the lack of how much humidity people think Med torts, Horsfield or Leos and Sullys need. The humidity outside here often gets above 80%, and most torts do better outside(obviously some of that's down to natural sunlight, another problem with lack of it and supplements), and even desert torts will have relatively high humidity in their tunnels. Just my opinion of course.

[Taurus]

Can anyone tell me what the best substrate is to maintain humidity levels high? I am struggling to keep it high enough for my stars despite spraying 2 to 3 times a day.. Thanks

[FLINTUS]

Originally Posted by Taurus

Can anyone tell me what the best substrate is to maintain humidity levels high? I am struggling to keep it high enough for my stars despite spraying 2 to 3 times a day.. Thanks

I use topsoil under the bottom and garden/woodland moss on top(usually sphaghum)

[EJ]

Can you explain how too much food would cause pyramiding?

Originally Posted by FLINTUS

I don't think a species is naturally more sensitive to pyramiding than another, personally I think it's down to how badly wrong there care is. Personally I think Leopards and Sullys are fed too much and kept at too low humidity, somone on RFUK has a friend with a smooth one and is trying to get a pic. Red foots tend to be overfed on protein or have a lack of humidity, Horsfields are left to stuff themselves, Stars I don't really know as I have hardly any experience with them but I might guess at low humidity again. A lot of the species we see smooth, like hingebacks are generally WC of course. I think the main problem is apart from the obvious in too much food is the lack of how much humidity people think Med torts, Horsfield or Leos and Sullys need. The humidity outside here often gets above 80%, and most torts do better outside(obviously some of that's down to natural sunlight, another problem with lack of it and supplements), and even desert torts will have relatively high humidity in their tunnels. Just my opinion of course.

[Merlin M]

Originally Posted by EJ

Can you explain how too much food would cause pyramiding?

Am with you on that Ed!

[Taurus]

Thanks guys, similar set up to mine though I also use orchid bark and coconut husk. The layer of topsoil I gave my be a bit too thin, hence the lack of humidify. Will try to increase and see what that does to it. Many thanks

[FLINTUS]

Originally Posted by EJ

Can you explain how too much food would cause pyramiding?

Wouldn't accelerated growth(because of overfeeding along with a few other things) combined with a lack of supplements cause at least some pyramiding? Just my opinion and you are probably more knowledgeable than me after reading how many torts you've got! I read in another of your posts you think temperature and humidity are the main apects. I completely agree about humidity, but didn't realise temps made such a massive difference.

[Mick.Ire]

Yes some tortoises are more susceptible to pyramiding than others. Leopards and stars would be much more prone to it in captivity. I can't comment on Horsefields or Hermanns as I don't keep them.
Sulcatas can pyramid bad but most in captivity get a little lumpy and then smooth out as they get big. I've seen some captive breds and their shells are as smooth as glass.
I have a star with a perfect smooth shell and I'm doing everything to keep it that way. I suspect he's WC and I spray his enclosure down at least once a day to increase humidity, have him eating nutrazu pellets and provide plenty of UV. I don't over feed either. I hope it works.
Hingebacks on the other hand rarely pyramid. I've rescued hinges in the past which have been kept in totaly wrong conditions yet they're shells are perfectly smooth.