'tough but necessary' - what do you think?

[swad1000]

I do think the benefits system needs a major overhaul, at the minute in quite a few cases its not even worth looking for a job.

My brother is in a pretty low paid job, his wife works part time and they've got 3 kids, from what he tells me he is basically working for less than a pound an hour as thats the difference between what he gets from working and what he would get completely on benefits ( they do get some benefits). But its even less than that when you take in to consideration the £20 a week it costs in petrol to go to work.

I don't think just because you're a single parent means you should be excused from work either (but I already think thats the case anyway isn't it? you still have to be looking for work even if you're a single parent) But there should be help to allow them to get back into work with child care costs etc.

I also think there should be limits on how much people can claim in benefits, I live alone in a 4 bed house I've worked for this house and pay my mortgage, I've lost a good chunk of my household income over the last 18months and if anything happened to me now and I couldn't work I'd basically be forced to sell and get somewhere smaller or go into rented accommodation as I don't need a 4 bed house so wouldn't get housing benefit.

Yet someone with 13 kids who has never worked can get 5,6,7 8+ bedroom houses costing £2-3000 a month in rent, all paid for out of benefits.

The benefit system was set up to help those in dire need and could not work, at the minute there are far too many that simply don't want to work, or its simply not worth working for the difference it makes.

Working should always make you better off than not, and it needs to be by enough to make the effort of going to work worth the reward.

[mark r]

at a time when the government are hitting UK residents hard with cuts in benifits, cutting the police force/nurses ect ect we can sit and console ourselves that at least they have decided ot to cut the Billions they send abroad each year in aid?.

CHARITY BIGINS AT HOME EXCEPT IN THE UK.

[Pussygalore]

I think that all benefits should be means tested, we simply have to many people in the country now to carry on giving it away, there was a fraction of the population when child benefit first started and although we say 'we pay our NI' what we pay doesn't anywhere near cover the amounts being paid out. For example one operation or major illness is more than most of us pay in a lifetime, however more help must be given to make sure that the elderly who often don't apply because of pride or just being to frightened aren't left sitting in the cold, maybe doctors should have more responsibilty to make sure they are getting everything they need. Maybe the benefits like the winter fuel one should be paid direct to the fuel supplier rather than the person to make sure that the heating is used, maybe it shouldn't be a set amount but rather the amount needed to provide that person with the heat needed. Many benefits like the child one don't go to the child where its needed again maybe it should go to the school for meals or come in the form of clothing vouchers anything to stop it being used for drink or cigarettes where much of it end up and it certainly should'nt be given to those who earn so much that it isn't even used. Benefits should never be so much that the recipient is better of than being in work and setting a max on the housing benefit so that you can't choose to live in a max rental property has to be a must although I think that one is already comming into use, no one should want to be on the social it used to be the last resort now to many its a voluntary choice.

[Pussygalore]

I also think that we should be a bit more like Australia and only allow immigrants who have 'so much money' and a trade who can prove they can support themselves and add rather than take away to the country. We have enough now thanks very much, no more please! As for the aid istead of ploughing into the dirt the supluss fruit/veg etc we could send that to the stricken countries, we stood on a fruit farm where hubby worked and watched an entire crop of apples ploughed into a field because they weren't making the money, they'd rather do that then give them to those that could use them, they even had government officials standing around to make sure the job was done thoroughly I couldn't beleive what I was seeing.

[suttysue]

I do feel strongly that some thing has to done with regard all the benefit system. We seem to have developed a society of leeches who couldn't give a dam. My niece has just left her husband, she has her 2 kids & is renting a house rather than going to the council for help, she said she had money thrown at her in benefits when she first needed help. She was mortified and has got herself a part time job which is actualy losing her £300 a monmth in benefit. She unlike others would sooner own her own crust.
We have to do something we are becoming LAZY .

[Alan1]

My boss used to put me down for an extra hour overtime if I was a little bit late getting finished. In the end I had to tell him to stop doing it because that extra hour put me into a higher NI band and I ended up paying more that week and getting less pay!

loose mouth cameron will divide the masses just like that evil old witch did in the 80's, turned people against each other she did

[justmeandmytortoise]

I find their recent decision about the child benefit ‘interesting’ when it comes to how this will work for families on one income and families on two incomes. This I feel is unfair, just because it is easier to work out the sums! Personally I set aside this money each month for my daughter, and it can help towards education costs etc when she is older.

There are many valid points, arguments and suggestions in your replies. Many of which I agree with.

I sometimes feel very sad and very lonely - ‘lonely in a crowd’. For I feel I am labelled. I am judged. I feel stigma attached to my life. When I first had my daughter I walked down the road pushing the pram feeling all the curtains were twitching and the neighbours I had grown up amongst all my life were whispering about me. Why … because I am a single parent. I didn’t ask to be a single parent but I have to live the life I am dealt and make the most of it. Not all single parents are out to have an easy life and choose to stay on benefits.

Yes, to have a child is a choice (unless attacked/raped). That choice is taken by two people. If one person walks away the other takes the majority/all of the responsibility and it is like a full time job – without the financial reward.

The welfare state was brought about following the Beveridge Report in 1942 to help eradicate poverty, disease etc., especially at a time when the industrial cities of the north showed a high percentage of people were living below the poverty line.

To an extent I agree with the welfare state. However I feel it has been abused and needs a shake up, with capping, and ensuring that only those that really need it receive it. I do not agree that anyone coming into the UK should be entitled to benefits. If I emigrated would I be able to claim on their system? I dislike reading/hearing about families where they stay on benefits and enjoy the large house, car, holidays and lifestyle they can afford through having child after child … and have no intention of working. But, we aren’t all like that.

I work part time. With travel I work a 40 hour week and watch as mothers outside the school gates who are on benefits talk about their trips out to the gym, holidays to Centre Parcs and when to plan their next child so they remain under the welfare system. One mother has a child every five years simply to keep the benefits going.

I am not on benefits, but I recognise that many parents have little choice especially if they have children with special needs or special circumstances. They would love to work, but cannot for various genuine reasons. But … we are often labelled and seen as all the same.

My hat goes off to those SW and other parents not on the Forum who have children with challenging behaviours, special needs, disability or a terminal illness preventing greater independence to allow them to take up employment. Bet they flop into bed at night exhausted … and well done for keeping a family together who many years ago would have gone into care or the mental health system.

Does it not feel as if the divide between low, middle and high income is getting wider?

The welfare state does need urgent reform … but please don’t judge us parents without seeing us as individuals first. Having children is a choice, a good one, a necessary one … otherwise it won’t be just the Last Tortoise that is on the verge of extinction!

A very emotive subject and one of great debate. I hope I have not offended anyone through 'written' conversation, as none is intended.

[Helen M]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-11466178

I find the above link very interesting. It shows that contrary to popular belief most benefits are actually given to those that are working to top up their income to an acceptable level via tax credits and housing benefit. Tax credits cost us £24billion a year.

To me it raises the question as to if the current minimum wage is acceptable? Clearly if so much money is given out via the government to tie people over on low wage then why do we simply not raise the minimum wage instead? Wouldn't that be a better incentive to work to begin with? And would prove to be more beneficial to a lot of other people now who currently work for minimum wage.

Helen xx

[Alan1]

What I can't understand is.. I know a woman who has 2 children, different fathers (I am not judging her on that BTW, just don't know whether that makes a difference to the benefits she gets), doesn't have a partner (that lives with her) and isn't married. She quite openly admits that she "can't afford to work". That may not be her fault, if she is so much better off on the benefits. It seems to me though that something is not right when she can afford to go to 2 pop concerts abroad in the same month, has a car and is out at the pubs or clubs every weekend while her mother watches the kids YET I know other women in the same circumstances who simply could not afford to do these things. I just don't get it

[Helen M]

I think its a case of some people being able to play the system better than others. I fear when all these cuts set it it is going to be the genuinely ill and disabled who are going to suffer more because unlike others they aren't going to be able to identify the loopholes or know their true 'entitlements'.

However just because people do buy material possessions like the plasma tv's or the holidays abroad doesn't necessarily mean they can afford it. Yes they may be on benefits but I know plenty of such people who are literally up to their eyeballs in debt to keep afloat.

Helen xx