Advice on neighbours tort please

alotoffluff · 06-05-2009, 09:03 AM

I have been wanting to ask you all for ages, and now my neighbour has actually asked me to ask you too.
Ok, where do i start?

My neighbour has a lovely spur thigh tort called George and he is 5 years old. She has had him since he was tiny.
He is now HUGE! Cant explain exactly how big he is!!! He must be a good 18" long and he is soooooo heavy.
She kept him in a viv when tiny and since he outgrew it, he doesnt have a home. He just wanders around her house and basks in front of her fireplace.

He is pyramided quite severly and she is quite proud that he likes to eat dog food. He has never had a bath and she rarely gives him water. Never has Uv and has never been hibernated.
The list goes on and on.......

A couple of months ago i noticed he has a severely overshot jaw. I asked her if she had noticed, and she did say that she thought he wasnt eating properly because of it.
So during my visit to the vets yesterday, i mentioned George to him, and he was quite shocked at how this tort is being kept. He urged me to get her to bring him in so he can assess him.
I went home to my neighbour and asked her to bring him in, but she said "what, so he can take all my money, no fear".

Soooooo she asked me to ask you guys what she can do for the overshot jaw?
I pretty much know what you are all going to say, but i think she just wants some proof from "people that know" that she needs to do something.

Im not judging her at all, please dont get me wrong. She is actually a very good friend. But it distresses me that she thinks the tort can wear his jaw down on "hard dog food".
The vet and i are concerned for the torts health, and i really dont know how to get the tort to him.
I understand the tortoise has probably adapted to this lifestyle but i was quite upset when the vet said the tort will have a short lifespan. I feel like i need to do something. My neighbour just needs re-educating maybe?
Thanks guys for any responses!

Lou · 06-05-2009, 09:36 AM

Hi Laura,

First off, tell her to google pyramided torts ... or torts fed dog food in google images... this will hopefully show her what dog food can do..

http://www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/webdiet.htm

is just one link , if you scroll down, you'll see the pictures.. they are not nice, so beware!!

Taking the tort to the vet and filing down his beak gradually is something she should be doing, if not though, I would be encouraging her to try to ween him off the dog food onto something more suitable and feeding him off some slate. Walking about on a carpet all day isnt just un hygenic (as he must be going to the toilet about the house not to mention eating all kinds off the floor!!) but its also really bad for his nails. What is he wearing those down on??

18" is HUGE for a 5 year old tort... i don't even know what to say about that apart from its all the protien in his diet. If she's struggling to get him off the dog food, I would try changing him to pellets... I know Ed recommends these at times, if you have a look through you'll find the ones he suggets, I can't remember the name of them, and then after that, try weening him onto the weeds. Sadly, sometimes its to much "hassle" for some people to go out weeding, at least the pellets would be a 100% improvement on dog food...

For her own and the torts healthy / hygine, this tort needs to be in a table. 18" is a big tort to be building for though!!! but I suppose if he's already roaming about the house... a large underbed storage would be no good I don't think... and if she doesnt want to spend any money, is she going to want to buy basking lights? hmmm doesn't sound like it does it? will she not rehome him? I am sure someone on here would want to help out. I certainly would ... even being so far and not really having the room. I'd make some for the fact this poor guy isnt being cared for in the best way.

I think you've mentioned this tort before??? doesnt sound like she wants to take your advice??

nina · 06-05-2009, 09:46 AM

Just a thought, but I wonder if this is actually a spur thigh (ibera or another sub-species), or if it is an African spurred tortoise (sulcata), as I can't imagine how a five year old could be 18" long. Could you post a photo of the tortoise so we can confirm the ID?

Needless to say, the husbandry is appalling, and I do hope that you can encourage her to change it.

Nina

terrypin · 06-05-2009, 09:52 AM

hi Laura this is terrible cant this poor creature go in the garden and have access to the lawn during the day .at 18" once warmed up he should be ok outside for a time even in winter.if they start to introduce rehydrated readi grass now, by winter you should have no problems with the diet.
terry

YummyMummy04 · 06-05-2009, 10:16 AM

Hello

I am not knowledgable like the others on here but wanted to say i hope you can help her to change for the sake of the Tort. And i wouldnt give tinned dog food to a dog let alone a Tort. Majority of tinned dog food is cr@p and ful of water and not a lot else!

Could he not go out in the garden to graze even that would be better than what he is getting now.

Good luck and dont give up.

alotoffluff · 06-05-2009, 10:27 AM

Sorry i keep calling Geroge a him, but he is actually a she according to my neighbour!
she does let her out on the garden on hot days but her garden is completely decked so theres no grass. But she does have lots of foilage for her to rummage through.
Theers NO way she would re-home her, she maintains she loves her and is doing the right things for her.
Her house is laminated throughout and she has no carpet anywhere, so the tortoise poo and wees dont seem to bother her. She does MASSIVE runny poos though, so it would bother me!!!

She has been talking about getting a dog house for the garden for her. I did mention slate to feed him off and she said, "oh yeh, i could put her favourites of red peppers and spinach on it". GROAN! I am going to get her a bit of slate myself though!
I am going to get some photos of her later - she is absolutely HUGE! You wont believe it! He, sorry - she - is a spur thigh, she has massive spurs on her back legs. I really want you guys to see her, she is lovely but unfortunately cared for in all the wrong ways.
I have said maybe she could get a lamp for the tort to bask under and she keeps saying she will, but never does.

Lou, thanks for the links, i will endeavour to get her to look. At least she actually asked me to ask you guys for advice, so its a step forward. The vet i spoke to last night is itching to get his hands on the tort!

alotoffluff · 06-05-2009, 10:31 AM

Lou i just looked at that link. That photo of the african spur thigh, i think it was the third pic down, is EXACTLY the same as my neighbours tort. Same pyaramids, same colours, similiar size!!! i though it was George when i saw it!!!!

alotoffluff · 06-05-2009, 10:32 AM

sorry, 4th picture down!!!

alotoffluff · 06-05-2009, 10:34 AM

my other major concern is that this tortoise must be seriously dehydrated as it doesnt have water or baths?? What harm will that do?

ME SHELL · 06-05-2009, 10:34 AM

Ahhh so she is a sulcata. Poor George, how is she in himself, does she walk around alot, or just sleep?

06-05-2009, 09:03 AM	#1
alotoffluff Senior Member Adult Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: greenwich, london, previously born and brought up in Kent! Posts: 2,127	Advice on neighbours tort please I have been wanting to ask you all for ages, and now my neighbour has actually asked me to ask you too. Ok, where do i start? My neighbour has a lovely spur thigh tort called George and he is 5 years old. She has had him since he was tiny. He is now HUGE! Cant explain exactly how big he is!!! He must be a good 18" long and he is soooooo heavy. She kept him in a viv when tiny and since he outgrew it, he doesnt have a home. He just wanders around her house and basks in front of her fireplace. He is pyramided quite severly and she is quite proud that he likes to eat dog food. He has never had a bath and she rarely gives him water. Never has Uv and has never been hibernated. The list goes on and on....... A couple of months ago i noticed he has a severely overshot jaw. I asked her if she had noticed, and she did say that she thought he wasnt eating properly because of it. So during my visit to the vets yesterday, i mentioned George to him, and he was quite shocked at how this tort is being kept. He urged me to get her to bring him in so he can assess him. I went home to my neighbour and asked her to bring him in, but she said "what, so he can take all my money, no fear". Soooooo she asked me to ask you guys what she can do for the overshot jaw? I pretty much know what you are all going to say, but i think she just wants some proof from "people that know" that she needs to do something. Im not judging her at all, please dont get me wrong. She is actually a very good friend. But it distresses me that she thinks the tort can wear his jaw down on "hard dog food". The vet and i are concerned for the torts health, and i really dont know how to get the tort to him. I understand the tortoise has probably adapted to this lifestyle but i was quite upset when the vet said the tort will have a short lifespan. I feel like i need to do something. My neighbour just needs re-educating maybe? Thanks guys for any responses!

06-05-2009, 09:36 AM	#2
Lou Senior Member Sub Adult Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Wigan - Greater Manchester Posts: 1,172	Hi Laura, First off, tell her to google pyramided torts ... or torts fed dog food in google images... this will hopefully show her what dog food can do.. http://www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/webdiet.htm is just one link , if you scroll down, you'll see the pictures.. they are not nice, so beware!! Taking the tort to the vet and filing down his beak gradually is something she should be doing, if not though, I would be encouraging her to try to ween him off the dog food onto something more suitable and feeding him off some slate. Walking about on a carpet all day isnt just un hygenic (as he must be going to the toilet about the house not to mention eating all kinds off the floor!!) but its also really bad for his nails. What is he wearing those down on?? 18" is HUGE for a 5 year old tort... i don't even know what to say about that apart from its all the protien in his diet. If she's struggling to get him off the dog food, I would try changing him to pellets... I know Ed recommends these at times, if you have a look through you'll find the ones he suggets, I can't remember the name of them, and then after that, try weening him onto the weeds. Sadly, sometimes its to much "hassle" for some people to go out weeding, at least the pellets would be a 100% improvement on dog food... For her own and the torts healthy / hygine, this tort needs to be in a table. 18" is a big tort to be building for though!!! but I suppose if he's already roaming about the house... a large underbed storage would be no good I don't think... and if she doesnt want to spend any money, is she going to want to buy basking lights? hmmm doesn't sound like it does it? will she not rehome him? I am sure someone on here would want to help out. I certainly would ... even being so far and not really having the room. I'd make some for the fact this poor guy isnt being cared for in the best way. I think you've mentioned this tort before??? doesnt sound like she wants to take your advice?? __________________ Louise... Horsfield: 1.0.2 Walter / Izzy / Tilly Redfoot : 1.3.0 Ruby / Scarlet / Merlot / Ginger Goldfish : 0:0:1 Splodge Bearded Dragon : 0:1:0 Zuki Springer Spaniel : 1:0:0 Bailey

06-05-2009, 09:46 AM	#3
nina Senior Member Adult Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Oxford Posts: 2,337	Just a thought, but I wonder if this is actually a spur thigh (ibera or another sub-species), or if it is an African spurred tortoise (sulcata), as I can't imagine how a five year old could be 18" long. Could you post a photo of the tortoise so we can confirm the ID? Needless to say, the husbandry is appalling, and I do hope that you can encourage her to change it. Nina __________________ http://www.thetortoisetable.org.uk l

06-05-2009, 09:52 AM	#4
terrypin Senior Member Adult Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: jersey c.i. Posts: 2,928	hi Laura this is terrible cant this poor creature go in the garden and have access to the lawn during the day .at 18" once warmed up he should be ok outside for a time even in winter.if they start to introduce rehydrated readi grass now, by winter you should have no problems with the diet. terry __________________ these are my own opinions do with them what you will. _________________

06-05-2009, 10:16 AM	#5
YummyMummy04 Member Hatched Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: In my house! Posts: 290	Hello I am not knowledgable like the others on here but wanted to say i hope you can help her to change for the sake of the Tort. And i wouldnt give tinned dog food to a dog let alone a Tort. Majority of tinned dog food is cr@p and ful of water and not a lot else! Could he not go out in the garden to graze even that would be better than what he is getting now. Good luck and dont give up. __________________ 1.1.0 Horsfield Tortoises ~ Toby & Tilly~ 0.0.1 Sulcata Tortoise ~ Bowser ~ 1.1.0 Bearded Dragon Lizards ~ Sid & Nancy

06-05-2009, 10:27 AM	#6
alotoffluff Senior Member Adult Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: greenwich, london, previously born and brought up in Kent! Posts: 2,127	Sorry i keep calling Geroge a him, but he is actually a she according to my neighbour! she does let her out on the garden on hot days but her garden is completely decked so theres no grass. But she does have lots of foilage for her to rummage through. Theers NO way she would re-home her, she maintains she loves her and is doing the right things for her. Her house is laminated throughout and she has no carpet anywhere, so the tortoise poo and wees dont seem to bother her. She does MASSIVE runny poos though, so it would bother me!!! She has been talking about getting a dog house for the garden for her. I did mention slate to feed him off and she said, "oh yeh, i could put her favourites of red peppers and spinach on it". GROAN! I am going to get her a bit of slate myself though! I am going to get some photos of her later - she is absolutely HUGE! You wont believe it! He, sorry - she - is a spur thigh, she has massive spurs on her back legs. I really want you guys to see her, she is lovely but unfortunately cared for in all the wrong ways. I have said maybe she could get a lamp for the tort to bask under and she keeps saying she will, but never does. Lou, thanks for the links, i will endeavour to get her to look. At least she actually asked me to ask you guys for advice, so its a step forward. The vet i spoke to last night is itching to get his hands on the tort!

06-05-2009, 10:31 AM	#7
alotoffluff Senior Member Adult Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: greenwich, london, previously born and brought up in Kent! Posts: 2,127	Lou i just looked at that link. That photo of the african spur thigh, i think it was the third pic down, is EXACTLY the same as my neighbours tort. Same pyaramids, same colours, similiar size!!! i though it was George when i saw it!!!!

06-05-2009, 10:32 AM	#8
alotoffluff Senior Member Adult Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: greenwich, london, previously born and brought up in Kent! Posts: 2,127	sorry, 4th picture down!!!

06-05-2009, 10:34 AM	#9
alotoffluff Senior Member Adult Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: greenwich, london, previously born and brought up in Kent! Posts: 2,127	my other major concern is that this tortoise must be seriously dehydrated as it doesnt have water or baths?? What harm will that do?

06-05-2009, 10:34 AM	#10
ME SHELL Senior Member Adult Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 8,484	Ahhh so she is a sulcata. Poor George, how is she in himself, does she walk around alot, or just sleep?

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