Article 10's

[16 shells]

This does bug me a little, when i see peep's selling a tort say a yearling, they don't want it anymore and there A10 is not upto date. I know it's the letter of the law and these outdated or loophole Gov pieces of paper, are ment to catch and can do, the big fish or dodgy dealer's. There's a Herman's advertised now, want's to sell thinking this is the place to find a good home, A10 probably not in order, he/she can give it away, a gift but don't sell it because the Defra rules stop you and a Defra team swot squad may attack your home.
Now the gift side, you want to sell say £90 to get your money back, but can't till you pay £25 to Defra, so you gift the tort and the buyer gift's you say for example a new phone worth £90, job done.
I don't/try not to break the three million plus law's the Gov has but a law made has to be water tight to work. I can't understand why they scrapped the Dog license and have this thing running for reptile pet's.
Catching illegal import's yes, penalising an owner of a pet/tortoise that's already in the country a joke.

[Alan1]

that's right, it actually encourages folk to sell their torts dodgy. 9 times out of 10 folk don't know what a A10 is or what to do with it anyway

[16 shells]

Originally Posted by caledonia

that's right, it actually encourages folk to sell their torts dodgy. 9 times out of 10 folk don't know what a A10 is or what to do with it anyway

Some one want's to gift me a Tortoise, but he want's an i pod touch as a gift, i know it's Christmas and snowing and all , but i'm a law abiding citizen.

[pagan queen]

OK can someone spell this out for me please.


I have a hatchling with a yellow A10. She is only around 45 mm. I would like to breed from her one day. What do I have to do with this A10?

Secondly, I have a spur thigh, sold to me as a "Russian" about 10 years ago, I have no A10. Does that mean I wont be able to breed from him if I want to sell the babies?

Please make this reply as simple and clear as possible as I have read many threads on this subject and either I am being thick or the whole thing is just one big confusion.

[NATURALIS]

Originally Posted by pagan queen

OK can someone spell this out for me please.


I have a hatchling with a yellow A10. She is only around 45 mm. I would like to breed from her one day. What do I have to do with this A10?

Secondly, I have a spur thigh, sold to me as a "Russian" about 10 years ago, I have no A10. Does that mean I wont be able to breed from him if I want to sell the babies?

Please make this reply as simple and clear as possible as I have read many threads on this subject and either I am being thick or the whole thing is just one big confusion.

ok , the first tortoise you want to breed from one day , all you have to do is wait til the tortoise is of breeding age then get it microchipped than apply for a new a10 in your name and with the microchip number, so until then you don't need to do anything. The second tortoise ( spur thighed ) you wont be able to get a full a10 without being able to prove it origin , however as the law stands now again when its of breeding age you could try to apply for a breeding certificate for the tortoise ( which will state you cannot sell it ) but if its granted you will be able to apply for a10's for any hatchlings produced by this tortoise.hope this help's

[pagan queen]

Thanks for that, it's all clear now. Does it cost anything to get a breeding cert?

[Pussygalore]

I think its £25 per certificate or £25 per batch if you apply for more than one at the same time, as for the one without a cert you'll need to get him microchipped, send a copy with a letter explaining how you got him and that he doesn't have any papers and you shouldn't have any trouble in getting papers for him. Microchipping prices vary so its worth checking around, maybe something to consider doing next summer. Its always worth emailing Defra as I've found them very helpfull in the past and quick to reply, their details can be found on the site.

[Bindi]

Originally Posted by 16 shells

This does bug me a little, when i see peep's selling a tort say a yearling, they don't want it anymore and there A10 is not upto date. I know it's the letter of the law and these outdated or loophole Gov pieces of paper, are ment to catch and can do, the big fish or dodgy dealer's. There's a Herman's advertised now, want's to sell thinking this is the place to find a good home, A10 probably not in order, he/she can give it away, a gift but don't sell it because the Defra rules stop you and a Defra team swot squad may attack your home.
Now the gift side, you want to sell say £90 to get your money back, but can't till you pay £25 to Defra, so you gift the tort and the buyer gift's you say for example a new phone worth £90, job done.
I don't/try not to break the three million plus law's the Gov has but a law made has to be water tight to work. I can't understand why they scrapped the Dog license and have this thing running for reptile pet's.
Catching illegal import's yes, penalising an owner of a pet/tortoise that's already in the country a joke.

I happen to agree with you Paul. It is a shame when someone comes to a forum where they hope to find a good home for their tort but are unable to sell because the paperwork isn't up to date. however, there can't be one rule for one and another for someone else. I had to update paperwork (and pay £25 for the priviledge) earlier this year to sell a young tort. I ended up out of pocket, but that didn't bother me as long as I had found a good home.

Obviously there are some that unwittingly or not, break the law, and some that bend it, i.e free tortoise with a £100 cardboard box.

I happen to know of one incident where Defra did indeed swoop and inspect a tort owners premises and paperwork (all was in order) so it does happen.

[Bindi]

Then don't chip them yet Vicky, why don't you wait till they are bigger?

I have a couple of torts with no Art 10s, they are re-homers, not chipped

[Bindi]

You don't have to have paperwork just to keep them...