Help, what sort of tortoise am I?

[EJ]

Since when? I'm not big on IDing Testudo but that is a perfect example of a whitei. I really don't think it is of Algerian at all... but what do I know.

Originally Posted by egyptiandan64

I agree It's a female Algerian spur-thigh, Testudo graeca graeca.

Jeff there's no such thing as a whitei

Danny

[JoesMum]

Now then you two .... Stop squabbling.

There is much debate about how many sub species of Testudo actally exist... and Whitei (named after Gilbert White's) Selborne tort is a particularly large version of Algerian TGG although measurements suggest the proportions differ from the smaller ones making it different. It depends on which papers you read as to whether or not Whitei should be categorised separately.

It does seem that Whitei achieves weights of around 4kg and I'm not sure that OP's tort is that big (gut feeling based on her apparent size relative to Joe who is 3kg)

You are both capable of google, but here's an example of one you can find:
http://www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/algeria.html

[bulldozer]

Thanks everyone for your help so far. i have a few more details about her and a few more questions. Her shell is about 10" long and 5" high, not sorted weight out yet! She only woke up last week when she came to me and I haven't seen her eat yet, is that normal? Her old owner told me once that she took a while to start eating after winter. She has never been under a lamp but lived outside in good weather and in conservatory rest of time and only ate weeds from their garden. I have given her a few baths and put her out in the sun in day time and she just sits in box in my kitchen rest of time. she does move about in day time but don't think she is up to speed yet. where would I get her nails looked at? normal vet? Last year my daughter got two 1year old Hermanns. they are very well and live in the house in a tortoise table. although I wont be putting them with Bulldozer do I need to worry about cross contamination of illnesses from one to other ( I think I remember someone telling me you should only keep one kind of tortoise?) Thanks again everyone, I really appreciate your help. I would love to keep her but mostly want whats best for her so all your advice is much needed to make my decision. Tracy x

[Bindi]

She's not going to eat untill she has warmed up enough. It would be a good idea to get some heat on her asap (you could use a normal spotlamp with a 60-100w bulb just to get her going) It's very important after hibernation as there is a danger they can suffer from post hibernation anorexia.

You're right to be cautious about mixing her with another tort. I don't personnally mix species, and she should be quarranteend as a precaution imo( she may or may not have her own hidden pathogens which coiuld prove fatal to another tort.

In any case, she would be too big to put in with a youngster of a year old

She is absolutely gorgeous btw

[JoesMum]

Tortoises can be very slow to adapt to new surroundings and an old girl like yours will be no exception. We're talking weeks as a timescale, not days.

When Joe comes ut of hibernation, it can take a couple of weeks for him to get eating anyway.

I would soak twice daily for the moment to get her rehydrated. Once at the start of the day and once at the end.

My tips for soaking are:
1. Soak your tort first thing in the morning before she's warmed up properly... she's less likely to attempt escape. Do it again in the evening when she's cooling down.
2. Soak at roughly the same time each day as it helps to establish a routine which will help your tort to settle in more quickly.
3. Use a bowl or plastic box with sides high enough to stop your tort seeing out or clambering out. A cheap washing up bowl is ideal.
4. Put enough warm (not hot) water in the box to come up over your tort's plastron (undershell). Get the temperature right and you're not-warmed-up tort is more likely to lounge and enjoy!
5. Soak for a good 20 minutes
6. Your tort may wee and/or poo in the water. They don't always, but if he does it is more likely to concern you than your tort. Change the water if it's truly disgusting. Don't be concerned if your tort eats her poo; it's said to help with gut flora!
7. Feed your tort straight after her bath. Again it establishes routine, but also they seem to want to eat after they've soaked and toileted!

I agree about not mixing species... and also about heat. It's not warm enough for her to be full time in the garden yet. She needs to go out warmed up and have access to full sunshine in a sheltered spot. Joe goes out around 11am at the moment and I pull him in when he's cooled down around 7pm.

[alley cat]

As has already been said it is important to get her warmed up and eating, some warm soaks might help, then feed her straight after her bath, then just look after her the same way she is used to, she has survived a long time with the routine she is used to and it would be wrong to try and change it all in my opinion if you already have torts I woiuldnt mix them, but I see no reason why you shouldnt keep her she is lovely, I would keep quiet about owning her, there are probably alot of people who would 'take her off your hands' in a flash

[Xero]

Originally Posted by nooddle

You have a horsfield tortoise there. With some advice and research I see no reason why this lovely old tort would not be happy to live out his days with you! Have a look at the enclosure pics threads for some great ideas. Anything more specific you need to know feel free to ask!

Abit big to be a horsfield, although i see what you mean from the colours.. they are quite similar but also if you look at the back of the shell its kinda flared... whereas a horsfields isn't.

[Catwoman63]

what a lovely old tortoise, but definately not a horsfield, she needs looking after in her old age xxxx

[cherylahutch]

What a beautiful tortoise I was a bit worried when horsfield was mentioned there as it looks kind of large lol I had visions of Elvis growing massive lol. Hope you do get to keep her she is really lovely :0)

[EJ]

Based on one paper that admits that further research is required. Once again you have to be careful taking information out of context.

In this case I would consider whitei a seperate species because the difference is quite obvious from the western forms. DNA is only one character that should be considered and as mentioned... the one paper does admit that their conclusions are not complete.

I was mistaken in the Algerian part... I thought it was found further east.

Originally Posted by stells

Whitei has never been a recognised subspecies... Ed you should be singing from the rooftops... you hate subspecies lol

What is described as Whitei... is just the a bigger Algerian Tgg. No difference in the DNA. Just a tortoise from a difference range in Algeria.