Help please with Gravid female
 

Hello
I have a 15 yr old Horsefield female that has mated my 12 year old male a few weeks ago
I have been watching her closely and today she was in her house and scrapping with her back legs. The garden is a very hot south facing garden and completely tortoise proof.
I had an idea with a large box and cut an entrance in it and put a mound of compost in it. She went in and dug a good size hole and thought she might lay. She then come out and went back in her house. Then fell asleep for the evening.
I obviously do'nt want her to lay and me not find them so has anyone got any suggestions and if the container is ok? Please see photos of it.
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Is this the only soil area she has? Maybe try her with a long bath? At the end of the day she will choose her preferred place & time! So it's a case of being patient, watching and waiting.

She has use of the whole garden, Lawn, gravel area and flower borders. If she laid in the garden I probably wouldn't find them, which is why I set up this box with soil. Also, I thought it would warm up with the sun and be more appealing to her. She is sniffing the ground as well. Is this a sign that laying is close?

If you want her to lay in the box (I have never had success this way) then it needs to be deeper. Her legs need to dig down beyond the length of her legs, and not touch the bottom.
Each tortoise has their own sort of laying area, I have two female iberas that will only lay eggs in my lawn, and at the edges where near concrete slabs or stone. Makes life easier as you can see where they lay:0) The other two, one will lay in the GH soil, and they other has no real area, just lays where she wants too. One even tried to dig on concrete, obviously it didnt work:0)
Watching where your tortoise is test nesting will give you a good idea where she will lay. I have grass disturbance marks all over my lawn, but they generally lay where they first started to try and dig.
If you dont dig over borders, you do have more of a chance of finding eggs:0)

Thanks for the replies, very helpful. I will keep a close watch over her. Just a few other things... what weather conditions are usual and what sort of time in the day? mornings they mainly spend warming up so I wouldnt have thought then. By 5am (usually to the minute) they go to their own huts to bed. They are like clockwork lol
Thanks again

It needs to be warm for them to lay, but it could be anytime of the day. Tortoises are fickle:0)

Hi Steve,

I had my nesting sites at least 8-10” deep at the top, with well compacted soil, so it doesn’t all fall apart as she digs. I used to boil the kettle and pour it on to get it nice and compacted, but not soaking wet. It soon dries out if there’s heat on it.
You want to be able to squeeze it in your hand and it won’t break up. Also, they like the soil warm, but hopefully as yours is in a south-facing sunny garden, it should be warm enough.

I know some people have put their tort and nesting box in a quiet dark room with only a heat lamp over the nesting box for light and heat and that has encouraged them to lay, but I’ve had no experience of doing that; mine have laid indoors either late evening or early morning on a wet and dark day, so maybe there’s something they like about it being darker. That said, both laid in the winter and early spring and I know of lots of torts who lay in the middle of the day in the garden in the warmer months. I’m sure they’re all different.

I found they sniffed at the soil a lot just before starting to dig, testing it’s temperature possibly, but that was a great indicator of imminent digging.

Hopefully she’ll find a suitable site soon. Let us know how it goes.

Well I came home and she has gone back into the box. I have a sheet of perspex on the top so its like a mini greenhouse. She is digging as I write!!
It's quit a deep hole but she has reached the bottom of the box as I can her scraping. I think I need to fill it deeper but not sure about disturbing her

She still might lay, if not your box works for her, so no eggs just top the box up with more soil:0)

good luck hope it all goes ok, CB

Hope she lays and then you'll both be relieved. :-)

After a long time in there digging, she came out and had something to eat and then went to bed. She obviously gave up as she could feel the bottom I assume. I have now made it a lot deeper so fingers crossed for tomorrow and have incubators out of the loft ready. Well I have two. Both used to hatch and brood bird eggs. One is an incubator with a fan above and the other, a homemade incubator...polystyrene box with ceramic bulb and very accurate thermostat. Not sure what one to use (That's if I am lucky enough to get eggs that is)
Both are set at 30c . I wondered if the vibration of the van will be a problem? wasn't with duck eggs.
Anyway, your suggestions are appreciated :-)

Good luck, but in my experience, they can be very fussy, this can go on for a week or two, digging the abandoning the hole and starting again the next day, but give her plenty of choice for a potential nesting spot. And any time of day goes, a couple of weeks ago, I was out until 9.30pm waiting for one of mine to finish up!

As Suze says tortoises are really fussy where they lay:0) As you are finding out, all perfectly normal. She will lay eventually:0)
As for incubators, I only ever used a homemade one, with a heatmat for the heat, heat controller for the mat, a polystyrene box and vermiculite to put the eggs on in a plastic container. Oh and a thermometer to check temps. This worked well for over 25yrs, I have now stopped breeding tortoises.
You could try using both incubators (if you have a normal clutch up to 5 eggs) to see which works best:0)
As long as the conditions are correct, I dont think the vibrations will affect the eggs:0)
If you set at 30c you will mostly if not all get male tortoises from the eggs. 30.5 - 31 mixed clutch and 31.5 -32 more chance of female tortoise. I used to go for the higher temps as when adult you need at least three females to one male:0)

Thats interesting Sandy. I read 30 for mixed. I will increase it to 31 - 32

Definitely stick to 32 if you want mostly females

Well how excited am I!! :-)

Right so now...do I need to brush them clean and mark the top with pencil?
Do I need perlite or can I use this compost she laid in?


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Well I marked them and left them as they are unless I need to do anything else
I just would like advice on humidity? Should I put a lid on the container holding the eggs? some do some don't. Do I need to put a dish of water in there or keep soil moist/ dry or change for perlite ?
Sorry for all the questions

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You should put a tub of water in with the eggs, with a wide top if possible. And keep it topped up.
I never damped the substrate the eggs are in, and never used a lid:0)
Fingers crossed for the eggs.
They should have a pinkish tinge to them at the moment, if they are fertile they turn chalky white:0)
But always better to carry on for the full time, for the experience.

Congratulations! I bet you’re massively relieved. Fingers crossed they’re fertile.

Do keep us informed as I will be looking for the continuing story!

Good luck.

I will keep the thread updated and thank you to everyone for their input and help

Congratulations, keep them dry vermiculite, it doesn’t need to be wet at all, or they can crack. as Sandy said , have a wide dish in there to provide humidity. If they are fertile , you will se the yoke sink to the bottom, in a few days, then you will see the shell go very white, this is called chalking, it’s usually a good sign. Humidity 75% . Good luck.

I have them on the compost which is pretty dry now. I didn't clean them as was unsure how to do it and was more worried about keeping them in the same position although thinking about it now I don;t think it matters just after they are laid. The soil on them might make it hard to see chalking but the candeller does work pretty well. I have put a tub with water in and hydrometer is reading 70 - 80 %

When they are first hatched , you can move them, for up to 24 hours, and as you said with the mud still on , it can be a bit difficult to candle , and to see any chalking. I would keep the humidity at no less than 75%, and 32c it you want mostly female. In about two weeks hopefully, when you candle them, you will see the ring of life, this is a red ring around a little pink jelly bean.

Thank you. Yes the humidity is at 75% exactly and i have the temp at 31.5c
I am used to incubating bird eggs and have done that many times so not turning is strange for me. I have a proper bird egg candeller with a long bendy stem so I don't have to pick them up. I will keep my fingers crossed to see the ring of life :-)

oooh how exciting ! good luck and threads like this are very good for everyone as we all learn still and others gain knowledge and enjoy ! CB

Sorry I didn't update last year. Eggs sadly were infertile. However, there have been three good mating's I've witnessed this week. How long is the gestation period? Last year she laid on 17th June so wondered when to expect laying

Laying the eggs depends on a suitable place for them to lay (and some are very picky) and of course the right weather. As far as I know (I could be wrong) there is no gestation period, as if the conditions are not correct, females will retain the eggs until its the right for them. And retaining eggs from one year to another can cause problems. Although they will retain eggs from late matings when weather is cold, through hibernation until the Spring. I have two females who are eggy and have been since they woke up.

She laid today. 3 eggs. This time I am more hopeful as I witnessed a few matings over the past few months.
I haven't got them in the incubator yet as im running it first to make sure.
Can I clean them as they are a bit dirty from soil and makes it so hard to candle? I am also going to incubate at 32.5 for female. Is this correct?

You dont have to clean them:0)
But its your choice.
And yes more chance of females if incubated at 32.5. I used to use this temp and did get mostly females. If using a bought incubator then you should get more females. Mine was home made:0)

Thanks Sandy. I will let you know how it goes. Fingers crossed for fertile eggs this year

Good luck, Steve. Let us know how you get on. x

Hi Steve.
I clean all my eggs as it is easier as you say to see what's happening.
Just be careful when doing it as some can become very slippery and can slip out of your fingers.
I allow mine to dry before marking them with a pencil.
Good luck and as Emma says keep us informed.

Years and years ago, when I used to raise ducks, all the literature I read about eggs told me to not wash off the slimy coating as that is a protection for the egg. So I don't wash off the tortoise eggs either. I just take a paper towel and brush off the dirt as best as I can.

Thought I'd post an update.
All three eggs are fertile and have know for a while now. Tomorrow is day 53 so nearly there. Few weeks ago I could see movement and obvious blood vessels. Today the air sac is quite large. Not much to see other than a few red blood vessels so I know they are all fine. Most is very dark so nothing to really see. I am assuming another 17 days and I should start to see babies :)
I will probably message nearer the time as not sure if I leave them to it as they have been or increase humidity etc. Don't want to do anything wrong after getting this far. Very excited!!

Great news, Steve. Thanks for the update. Sounds like it won’t be long now.
It’s very exciting isn’t it. Very much looking forward to seeing some hatchling photos from you. :-)

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Help please!!! What do I do? I think they are only 55 days today :confused:

Sorry if I have posted the photo wrong

It can take a couple of days for the hatchling to actually break completely out of the shell. As sometimes they break out with still a largish egg sac.
Keep them in the incubator until they are out. Of course keeping an eye on them.
If by any chance they do break out of the egg with an egg sac, dont panic :0)
As if small will absorb quite quickly, but keep on damp (not wet) kitchen towel, if out of the shell.
If a large egg sac, then place hatchling on damp kitchen roll in something like an egg cup so he/she is upright, and cant move about. In the incubator:0)