Uni' torts

[Ajay]

I know I've asked you guys to help me id these same torts before but I now have better pictures, plastron shots where requested and also discovered another tortoise in the set up.. So, can we start again please? For my clarification. The people in charge of these tortoises told me today they've had a "reptile expert" (I'm not putting his name on here..) identify, age (???) and sex them all. Either the man in question is mistaken or they've payed no attention whatsoever - tell me there's not three hermanns in this group!!

Tortoise one: a "male spurthigh", underside and plastron shot. The white is paint, used for telling them apart. Don't get me started
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xkXCA.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xkXCA)
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xoL4i.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xoL4i)

Tortoise two: a "male hermanns" (*cough*), underside and plastron shot. The red is paint, see above
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xmHmS.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xmHmS)
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xpxY9.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xpxY9)

Tortoise three: (larger) "male hermanns", underside
http://www.postimage.org/Pq1f8yd0.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Pq1f8yd0)

Tortoise four: (smaller) "male hermanns", underside, plastron and side - to show shell shape, damage, nails and to attempt to show his beak - my friend who helped me take the pictures even exclaimed at the state of him (she's only seen my little girls)
http://www.postimage.org/Pq1f8ZEA.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Pq1f8ZEA)
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xqEO9.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xqEO9)
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xtPlA.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xtPlA)

Tortoise five: "female leopard", just the tail. Today is the first time I've seen her move - because I picked her up :cry:
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xstxJ.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xstxJ)

Their food.. we identified: rocket, cauliflower, cauliflower leaves and aubergene... (not needing identification - or sexing!, I'm just cross that they've ignored all the stuff I gave them when I visited last - we even have the Andy Highfield feeding book in the library :evil: :cry: :shock: )
http://www.postimage.org/aV1xvk80.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1xvk80)

I'm not putting the name of the place on this post. If you can't work it out please feel free to pm me

[Henry-flash]

Not attempted ID'ing for a while so here goes.
1 - Male, Testudo graeca graeca.
2 - Male, Testudo graeca graeca, morroco.
3 - Male, Testudo hermanni boettgeri.
4 - Male, I was thinking along the lines of ibera, but then I looked again and confused myself :oops:

[sandy]

Well I for one wouldnt take any notice of so called expert. They have not got a clue<g>.
First a graeca I think, would help with a top shot.
Second a hermans.
Third graeca.
Forth unknown without a carapace shot.
Are they sure their expert isnt a tree expert in disguise<g>.

[Ajay]

Er Sandy? They all have carapace and plastron shots :oops:

Thanks guys :-)

lol quite possibly, will await people's opinions on him should they ask who he is

Can anyone sex the leopard tortoise for me please?

[midi-mania]

omg! i feel sorry for the second to last tortoise :cry: its shell looks soo bad :( are they kept together ?!? dont they have any weeds ?!?

[Ajay]

They're kept in this:

http://www.postimage.org/aV1AjdOi.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1AjdOi)

This is the reason I'm writing my enclosure design on these tortoises - last year someone did theirs on the rabbits concluding they needed grass.. Now the rabbits have grass (that's right, they didn't before).

If my assignment has no effect, the endless list of complaints will. I talk about my girlies so much that my class and friends are disgusted at the state of that poor little fellow (he looked better than that two years ago when I first got here) and all complained to the powers that be..

I'll have them sorted or removed one way or another!

[midi-mania]

thats trible!, if you dont mind me asking what are the big trays full of water with bricks in them for??? they look like a tortoise would have trouble getting in and out? especialy if its one of the smaller torts

[egyptiandan64]

Hi Ajay,
The pictures aren't quite in order so I'll go picture by picture. :D
1st picture........plastron of a male T. g. graeca
2nd picture.......carapace of a male T. h. boettgeri
3rd picture........plastron of a male T. g. graeca
4th picture........carapace of a male T. g. graeca
5th picture.........plastron of a male T. h. boettgeri
6th picture.........plastron of a male T. g. nabeulensis
7th picture.........carapace of a male T. g. nabeulensis
8th picture.........carapace of a male T. g. nabeulensis
9th picture.........female S. p. babcocki

Danny

[sandy]

Lol if the pictures were in order my list would make more sense<g>.
As I did wonder if the one before the leopard was a tunisian.

[Ajay]

Argh! Lol sorry guys! My bad. Thanks heaps though. If you need more/clearer pictures from more angles of something to be more sure please say so, I want as definate an answer as I can get. Thanks again!!

Midi-mania, they're cat litter trays with bricks in them for drinking/bathing water. The little hermanns couldn't reach with a ladder, the leopard can make it in easily but out is a different story and the others don't even try.

You also don't want to know how much muck, litter and hair ends up in their enclosure instead of the bin.. :cry: :x

When I finally get to meet whoever's incharge (they always pass the buck when you ask) I'll ask if I can have them rehomed. They're never going to look after them properly.

[Ajay]

Just to be clear, could people please tell me which of these species do/do not hibernate.. I can see a major disaster coming and could do with knowing pretty damned urgently :? :shock:

[egyptiandan64]

The Tunisian and Leopard no hibernating. I personally wouldn't hibernate the T. g. graeca. If the Hermanns has good weight then yes they could hibernate him, but I suspect he doesn't.

Danny

[Ajay]

I weighed and measured them all when I took the pictures, I wanted advice from people I can trust. Not their so called experts..

I'll try to get them all right..

?Tunisian? (very small one!) 12.4cm 0.33kg preparing for hibernation...
Leopard (obvious) 38cm 8.06kg not hibernating
Hermanns (I think..) 17.5cm 0.91kg "leaving him a few weeks before preparing for hibernation"
Tgg (I think.. red spot) 19cm 1.11kg same as above
Tgg (I think.. white spot) 21.5cm 1.75kg preparing for hibernation with the little one

Incase I've confused you as much as I've just confused myself.. All but the leopard will be prepared for hibernation before the Christmas break. Two are already being starved and bathed daily, the other two are being fed what you see above, with the leopard..

I think I'll be setting up a major meeting tomorrow... Is the diet for the Tunisian and the Tgg similar to hermanns? I already know the leopard isn't being fed well :cry:

[egyptiandan64]

Yes the diet for the 3 Greeks is the same as for the Hermanns.
The Tunisian should be 445g so he's light, to light and shouldn't be hibernated anyway.
The Hermanns should be 1,025g so not bad, but and I'll get to that :D
The smaller Greek male should be 1390g so he's light also.
The larger Greek male should be 1,890g so not bad, and but also

With the diet being that poor I'd worry about the 2 with not bad weight. They may be hanging onto urates and thats why they are that heavy.

Danny

[Ajay]

Thanks Dan, will see what can be done and how quickly tomorrow. I'm livid it's this bad at a university! Especially mine! :cry: